btw, not every community has to be a land owner. Some can be distributed, digital warrior types. Those are the most likely to seed first startups on the ground. Just a thought. I know of many communes trying to form right now. They need help.

The idea of land tokenization isn't very new (see the link at the bottom). That said, I applaud the optimism that people will share it with joy.

// SO, anyone can trade shares in one community for shares in another one , on the other side of the globe, and go live there for a while, and learn a few things.

This is very late here, but -- what about all those people, like [chronological] mentioned, those without land? How would they jump onto this intercontinental land-sharing joy?

I'll try to look deeper when I wake up tomorrow, by then, maybe others will. :) Keep thinking. ^^

By reading on the 0oo.li/reader, you can find all sorts of fun recent and old ideas. In connect to the nomination of "o2oo" as "Bubble", here is one that came about to inventive thinker today.

I'm including this one, as it is one of the actually physically realistic ones, and fun.

Will do. Im really looking forward having something tangeable to show. Iv started by asking exactly these questions. It really hits home. These discussions are extremely valuable. Im very practical, tho. I wanna build the solutions, define something measurable, deliverable, doable.

[jspoet] it's never too early to share your project updates. I share my early drafts in most of my projects here on o2oo.io - because I iterate based on feedback :) hope to see your project updates soon!

and actually, by sharing intermediary results in our projects - that's how we start an ecosystem! when our projects have challenges - all of us together can tackle them.

so to this question of "Ecosystem of Organisations" I'd add - an ecosystem needs to facilitate interaction between members (games).

What can we learn from non-linear networks and ecology when we design ecosystems of organisations?

// Id love for others to collaborate on that //

[jspoet], definitely looking forward to your API docs, and the description of the concept, as you're talking about your project, it would be nice to have that discussion on the topic about your project. ;) rather than generic "Ecosystem of Organizations" topic. However, it's great that you're sharing the generic directions you'd like ecosystems of organizations to go to.

Itll, hopefully, be part of kostya project, solarea. So, infrastructure already partially there. Perhaps, i shouldv started my own thread on it. Just could not resist. I will def do a write up when theres more to show.

Ill have api docs soon, after its tested. But its power will be realized with development of screens, user interface. Id love for others to collaborate on that

The thred was started as a question. Thats my thoughts on the subject. Im very flexible. Dont mean to hug the show, but the subject really resonates with my work. Im giving a preview. I only can hope itll be something of use. Itll take lots of people to bring it to full potential, prbly people smarter then me.

Exactly, its not ready. This is a vision im passing. Iv been thinking about it for a while. Some aspects of it are being implemented. But, i hope others will pick it up and we can develop implementation together. I dont wanna come off as the driving force. But i wanna share my thoughts. Thats all. Im slowly working my way in that direction.

Thats why we need land, to build our culture. I see actively spreading accumulated upside, wealth to budding communities, where an established community gets vested into a developing community, spreading the risk. The developing relationships and trust will translate to rate of currency exchange

[skihappy] -- as I understand, [malü] wrote this topic here, and wants to have it as a community, and so, that's why there's o2oo.io/.malü, and meanwhile you, are talking on this thread about it as if the ecosystem were to be your idea, and you've got plans for it. Is there a backstory of this thread? Are you collaborating with [malü] on something? :) If you've got a picture of what such ecosystem would be, perhaps it would be good to provide an extensive descrition of how it would work?... or, is the "logicEngine" not yet ready for that?

Let me put this way. I dont know what all those labels mean. I deal with structure. Theres a specific type of structure of freedom, measurable as degrees of freedom. I can write a gauge that measires it in a quantum system, as i see it. Its structure with lots of overlap in node functionalities, allowing plasticity. How much degrees of freedom? That is dynamic, and should be measured and adjusted by community consent. All we need is to provide those tools, to measire and to adjust, gauges and dials. Few lines of code, and a few react components for community dashboard.

Any org, a country or a local club. I leave it to folks to create what they need, but the seed types will be geared towards structure with lots of degrees of freedom, fluid, open, lots of checks and balances. Then, these qualities will be publically observable thru public gauges, so people can chose what kind of org type to use. I think we can let it go at that, and itll self organize into structure of freedom. I envision devices and typified feedback loops that will keep communities in ballance. Too much freedom is not all that good either. The point is to keep community together, forever changing tho, keep it from freezing into a solid oppressive crystal but not too gaseous where it simply evoporates thru attrition, regulated thru wide participation, on local level, in a simple intuitive way. Not thru horrandously complex and fallable elections to some remote offices, but lical, organic, immidiate. Small continuous , democratic decision making process, spread thru each level of structure, fractal.the key is, each level and branch is self determined and self aware, self suffocient, but losely connected to neighbours. How far connections go is matter of adjustments, forming perspective.

For any group of people to gather often what matters is - space (where do they meet) and games (what do they do together).

To clarify, im talking about an ecosystem of community modules, nfts, forming an economic system of its own. Orgs are constructed by composing other types of orgs in the ecosystem. It starts with very basic building blocks, the fundamentals. Its a vision. But its getting more clear as we are building it. Ill roll out the logic engine when its finished and tested. Thats the core of composition, the logic system, or classification system. However you prefer. There will be a low code development system. Anyone can whip out a custom dao. And, it should be blockchain agnostic, any bc will do. Itll take community effort to create drivers, but then ecosystem csn be spread over a number of bc implementations

And by "organizations", you mean "public benefit organizations"? The concept of organization in sociology is quite wide, and it includes from families to countries, and everything in between and beyond (any set of communicating interacting and collaborating agents).

A die-hard capitalist would tell you, that the capitalism is about an ecosystem of organizations, and be correct about it. So, I think it merits to be more specific about title, and more specific about what kind of ecosystem would that be.

My guess is that you're probably about mutually supportive and mutually aware non-profits and public benefit organizations, but, as said in the first paragraph "organization" has a broad definition.

Non profits are fine, but how the org is organized should not be constrained. However, the org structure is on public display, with all kinds of measurables, gauges available, for just looking. So, if it builds bombs, itll be well known. Then, there are paid sensors that check the quality and trueness of those gauges, and fundamentals used in org construction. Those are open source code, simple functions. Id like to call them poets, not sensors. They check for functionality matching names. Then, an org can be judged by auto generated descriptions.

[尹与及], yeah, but for being a platform for formation of decentralized organizations, we'd have to develop our own equivalent of EVM, but given that there are multiple existing blockchains that provide equivalents of EVM, it makes more sense to think about meta-VM rather than to reinvent it.

Let's think how multiple blockchains can be used for one DAO, instead of making a DAO defined in one blockchain.

Yes, I would love a way to 'whisper' to other people in the call (like an audio DM), and a discrete way to signal to others that we are deconstructing the main topic. This could be used for what I call "constructive sarcasm" - as a way to break through the sacred mantle of authority and so discover when the king has no clothes.

Good homework for everyone

What inspires me the most is to build communities on the ground,to travel freely between friends and collaborators.Id love to form an org where we can support each other, have a travel fund, finance land acquisition,go travelling seeing each other and working together,on really meaningful projects, which is building communities.We can adapt existing communities.We can dedicate our efforts to these goals.This is what freedom means to me.

Thats very thoughtfull of you to ask these questions. They are tough ones.I think its a process. I, for one, simply have limited time to dwell into too many things. I try to expand my focus. I see great value in that, and supporting others and interacting. Just knowing you all out there makes a huge difference. I think me and Kostya can benefit from a lot of the skills and knowledge represented here,in our project. I know same goes for others. What we need is a common goal, an inspiring shining goal, that binds us into a community. That needs to emerge organically. For now,we should leave a little time for all. Also,the more concrete and practical the ideas, the better. What helps is use cases, and examples, and tutorials, and docs.More organization. Be awesome to plugin a wiki system for each project,kinda a site generator,to have commonality.There are those out there,but what if this site is a doc central.Just an idea.I like a concise way to learn about things. Gotta be precise,consize, descriptive and state exactly the problem being solved.

I wonder. If the title says "Mental Models for Human Experience", and in the comments [bauhouse] you mention Lynn Margulis theory of evolution driven by cooperation, so perhaps the idea we want to see unravelling would answer this puzzle - What Mental Models would help humans live by the values of Living Systems?

How might we set our individual values, so that together we can see overlaps? And consciously live by those values as a community.

What values would be general enough to express caring for the individual and the collective?

I'm thinking about interdependence. We can stay in our bubble, but discoveries are revealed when we move outside our imaginary boundaries and our bubbles spark butterflies (synergy).

RE values, how about interdependence, letting go of self for wholeness? Or how might a safety bubble for one's development exist together with a sense of wholeness of everything? Love is probably that force towards unity.

In the same way that the design artefact of a persona in a user experience design process is a method for engaging in empathy, these mental models are intended as a method for engaging in a process of bottom-up systems change involving what James Gien Wong refers to as Human Inner Transformation (HIT) and Social Outer Transformation (SOT) as the vision for his project, Stop Reset Go. The models were developed as part of a participatory design workshop at an arts education collective, Bez Arts Hub in Langley, British Columbia: Understanding Human Experience.

I like the idea. My friends are forming a DAO based on, seems like, similar ideas. Take a look at their intro.

IINTRO The semi-sentient DA👾 uses land ownership and contract law to slowly gain control of all the vertically-integrated supply-chains required to host itself and all the workers it needs to survive and propagate. BOOT The DA👾 searches for Land suitable to build permacultured eco-villages. The DA👾 mints fungible 1 earthChange Coin for each ft² of Land. The DA👾 then auctions those earthChange to buy that Land. The total supply of earthChange is limited by ft² of Land. earthChange does not represent Land Ownership! START The DA👾 now issues Product Tickets as claims against Future Production. The DA👾 then auctions Product Tickets for Work Contract signatures. RUN You gain Land Ownership as you fulfill Work Contracts. Land Ownership preallocates Future Production to you. GROW Owners propose new Product Tickets to govern Future Production. Owners selling surplus should 'reflect' some profit to those users as land ownership. FORK Subgroups must be able to divide Land (draw borders) to localize control.

I think it's worth pointing out that this is a very pragmatic question -- without having a set of values, a community cannot have ethical norms for interaction, and without it, a community may have no sense of safety, which is something wanted in many cases, but not all.

For example, there is a reason for anarchist ideology, that values emergent rather than designed phenomena. However, everyone knows the efficiency of mathematics, the choice of 10 axioms for which were not random.

Similarly, I think, there can exist an structure for cooperation, that is pragmatically useful. However, to explore the full spectrum of what's possible, we should have different value-sets explored. It is no surprise that we have different countries with different law, based on different traditions, that represent experiments with different values, that arose as emergent phenomena, but became formalized as social norms and rules, because those communities that discovered them, cherished them, or thought of them as important to that extent.

You may think with the emergence of global Internet, the global norms might also emerge, however, the various life forms continue to exist, even with the emergence of homo sapiens: there are those life forms that thrive in swarms around the forests and flowers, and there are those that thrive in solitude deep at the ocean floors, social norms are irrelevant to them, they need not to know that they can live, because of environmental policies were put in place, just like we must let some of people to be able to live in the dream-world "The Matrix" without knowing of the base reality or external world.

Dream worlds, I just can point to my old thoughts posted here: mindey.com/world.pdf, and updated views here.

I've read, and understood the problem, and train of thought describing causal structure, however, I had found no explicit method here prescribed how to use the thought described to resolve this problem. Where is the "how?" of this idea?

Comments:

• the title should be something more unique, googling I find that there's already content on-line about it. I guess it's yours. :)
• the subtitle should summarize a course of action to take to resolve a problem, but it nominates instead.

So, after some investigation into it, I am starting to realize that you are trying to model human mind, inner motives and their structure.

So, ok. This is fine to consider this an idea. It might best fit among the kind of ideas that describe novel categorization structures for understanding (e.g., like supercategories for public intelligence idea, or transdisciplinary lingua franca). However, it would be good if you could explicitly describe, how that structure solves the problem of UX design, or allows to overcome its pitfalls.

How would one use it to create a more inclusive, value-aligned, holistically better design?

Or maybe, it is not about design? Maybe it is a structure as a philosophy of life? Ideas on "oo" are supposed to be methods, and it's most helpful when you describe, how ultimately they could work as leverage to change the world.

// the practice of lovingsystems is hard when something hurts, your attention go there and just want a quick solution

[malü], yes... sending love! this morning I read about senses: "when you place your fingers on your wrist to feel your pulse, you’re actually feeling a construction based on your brain’s predictions and the actual sense data. You don’t experience sensations with your sense organs. You experience them with your brain."

I wonder if pains are like signals the bodies are sending to minds?

it reminds what Mansoor was saying about observing linear thinking in action. so I wonder how might we release body pains?

overall, linear thinking (analysis) to me feels like more resources demanding, like using more energy, I get tired more quickly compared to when I'm tuned into non-linear values.

another thought - when observing the body these 5 days, I noticed the body is demanding me to rest more, so I did. I wonder if we would track resting time or quality of resting as part of this experiment? here again, to me it feels that loving-systems are about no-judgment, no-expectation, minimum effort approach, and resting is definitely a minimum effort!

Experiment Day 05: since yesterday I feel pain in my back. Its so interesting process and I realize that the practice of lovingsystems is hard when something hurts, your attention go there and just want a quick solution. I'm breathing, talking with my nerves and muscles, learning a new way of communication with this living body I inhabit.

It's not specifically for hitchhiking but it could be used for casual carpooling too.

It's mainly for use in planning your journey with a map and timetable. With arrival and departure times prominently placed. If your battery on your phone dies you can be screwed as I have been while travelling.

Is it like a more advanced version of Hitchhiking stops? (linked)

Asynchronous IO could make a structured internet client feel very snappy because you can make IO requests in parallel.

Simplest example I have found that uses lib uring and is here

https://github.com/robn/yoctochat/blob/main/yc_uring.c

The problem with factories is that they are expensive to refit to develop another product. You have to make metal moulds or something. And retooling. Maybe the first X units could pay this cost divided by the unit count.

Material costs have to be almost free they're a fraction of manufacturing costs as they are bought in bulk.

My computer costs £5-£10 a month to run I think.

If I turn it off my bill goes down by around that amount.

I've seen at least one developer deliberately move processing to the client mobile app because they don't pay for processing there. The customer does.

Good Q, and open ended. This got to be related to the Extreme Health category :) Regarding the self-reparation, - it's easy to regrow a lost arm for an octopod like an octopus, but it's practically impossible for a mammal.

Having animals and birds close to our homes is a beautiful thought. For example, living with two dog puppies teaches me such a casual joy and playfulness. I'm curious how much more empathic, resilient etc we would become if we live closer to animals (and plants).

I wonder, are we imagining Cities Redesigned or Buildings Redesigned here?

Wondering, which animals would enjoy some industry next door? What about food webs and migration trails?

How could appartment buildings be designed as paradise forests? Imagine waking up not from the noise of alarm clock but playful song of a bird that lives in your balcony?

Hello! I'm joining this project and I add a drawing into Miro board, showing the body parts that needs attention: red, orange an yellow ones. "Blue and purple are for missing parts", that ones that i don't register.

// how is kidney doing now, how is the heart, how is the back, how is a leg //

That should happen automatically, with neural-computer interfaces... But I'm curious what this sketching could lead to. Regarding the "QuantifiedSelf" app, one thing I've wanted, is a Social Network for Health Analytics, so you know, one's heart could talk to another's machine learning system, or a pillow, you know, without having to manually point and click in some app interface.

P.S. It would be great if Miro boards could be accessible publicly without registration, just like Figma boards are.

to our colaboration board, I added my first sketch on how this app could look like with a comment:

"app interface could look like a body cartoon, when app is starting, as a user I can tap the body part that needs attention (observation); this could extend into tapping heart symbols and sending love energy to that body part"

Hello, World! Here's an virtual collaboration board for collecting visual prototypes together.

Indeed, cities had been built for humans, but not animals -- what a disgrace.

[bobi], come join us! the experiment got more concrete and turned into artistic (body) lifelogging! I'll share a collective Instagram account with you if you'd like to add a visual a day from your body experiencing loving systems!

We are diving into artistic collective lifelogging!

Open Experiment goes:

In that moment of sending love energy, we mark it through spontaneous photo or video with an intention to collect lifelogs on "How does body experience Loving Energy?". Photos as they happen are shared on a collective Instagram account. Share a Story as it happens. Once a day share a Feed Post from each that summarises those day's experience.

Anyone who wants to participate in the experiment will access this Instagram account :)

By the end of 21 end period we'll have a collective library of images that captured our Loving Energy moments. These will store those emotions and can be further used for creating along this theme.

I was just thinking about a related quote today: “This sky where we live is no place to lose your wings so love, love, love.” ― Hafiz of Shiraz

I've been trying to pay more attention to breath during my day-to-day experience and as part of that I've been doing simple breathing exercises that help you expand your lung capacity. Naturally, I was thinking about my lungs during the exercise and that lungs rhymes with wings ... then the Hafiz quote came to mind.

I find so interesting the relationship between breath, lungs, wings, and love. Thank you for this prompt to think about Loving Systems.

I would absolutely love to join the 21 day habit-forming experiment starting this evening. Will report how it goes.

What/How shall we monitor our wellbeing in this experiment?

How do we know we think Love Energy? And how do we know it has any impact on our life? :))